Re: [SIGCIS-Members] Older computers (1940-1950)
If we include the ABC, we may as well add Couffignal's computer, an electronic, parallel calculator programmed from an external disk.
I agree about ABC being of a different, lesser class than the others on the list. Hadn't heard of Couffignal, very interesting!
As one who is guilty of having constructed lists of machines, their operational date, and whether they were "first" or not, I now feel we ought to back away from such listings. One of the reasons the Colossus machines are often left off of these lists is that, by the time details of their existence became known, historians were not so interested in such chronologies any more. Not to be flippant, but where do we list all the women (and a few men) who were computers during the 1940s? That was their job title. Paul E. Ceruzzi Chair, Division of Space History National Air & Space Museum MRC 311; PO Box 37012 Washington, DC 20013-7012 202-633-2414 <http://www.nasm.si.edu/staffDetail.cfm?staffID=24> -----Original Message----- From: members-bounces@sigcis.org [mailto:members-bounces@sigcis.org] On Behalf Of Evan Koblentz Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2012 8:29 AM To: members@sigcis.org Subject: Re: [SIGCIS-Members] Older computers (1940-1950)
If we include the ABC, we may as well add Couffignal's computer, an electronic, parallel calculator programmed from an external disk.
I agree about ABC being of a different, lesser class than the others on the list. Hadn't heard of Couffignal, very interesting! _______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members@sigcis.org, the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://sigcis.org/pipermail/members/ and you can change your subscription options at http://sigcis.org/mailman/listinfo/members
That's true, Paul. Yet as we cannot keep people in the cybersphere from establishing such lists, better have a little control on them – including warning about the limits of their historical value. Speaking about human / non- human computers, i can't resist offering a little glimpse of the Turing exhibition that we opened last night in Paris. In the 1940s (perhaps earlier), Alan Turing, like many others, used a Brunsviga desk calculator. He even compared its "memory size" to that of other calculators : Brunsviga : 60 bits. Manchester Baby : 1 024 bits. Project ACE : 60 000 bits. (from the excellent biography by Andrew Hodges) What few people seem to have noticed is the commercial logo & motto of the Brunsviga manufacturer: Without extrapolating to far, one may imagine Alan Turing winking at this image (or vice-versa?) Best, Pierre Le 15 nov. 12 à 14:46, Ceruzzi, Paul a écrit :
As one who is guilty of having constructed lists of machines, their operational date, and whether they were "first" or not, I now feel we ought to back away from such listings. One of the reasons the Colossus machines are often left off of these lists is that, by the time details of their existence became known, historians were not so interested in such chronologies any more.
Not to be flippant, but where do we list all the women (and a few men) who were computers during the 1940s? That was their job title.
Paul E. Ceruzzi Chair, Division of Space History National Air & Space Museum MRC 311; PO Box 37012 Washington, DC 20013-7012 202-633-2414 <http://www.nasm.si.edu/staffDetail.cfm?staffID=24>
-----Original Message----- From: members-bounces@sigcis.org [mailto:members-bounces@sigcis.org] On Behalf Of Evan Koblentz Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2012 8:29 AM To: members@sigcis.org Subject: Re: [SIGCIS-Members] Older computers (1940-1950)
If we include the ABC, we may as well add Couffignal's computer, an electronic, parallel calculator programmed from an external disk.
I agree about ABC being of a different, lesser class than the others on the list. Hadn't heard of Couffignal, very interesting! _______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members@sigcis.org, the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://sigcis.org/pipermail/members/ and you can change your subscription options at http://sigcis.org/mailman/listinfo/members _______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members@sigcis.org, the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://sigcis.org/pipermail/members/ and you can change your subscription options at http://sigcis.org/mailman/listinfo/members
On Nov 15, 2012, at 5:46 AM, Ceruzzi, Paul wrote:
As one who is guilty of having constructed lists of machines, their operational date, and whether they were "first" or not, I now feel we ought to back away from such listings.
I am sure Paul appreciates that the “when” is almost as difficult as the “what”. Unfortunately, it’s quite challenging to communicate (in 50 words or less) a nuanced temporal view of the creation of any technology to a general interest audience that may not have any prior knowledge of scientific or engineering processes. For our exhibitions at CHM we attempt to find dates that one could reasonably consider to represent operation of the system in the case of one-offs. For production machines, we tend to go with introduction or announcement dates. — Alex Bochannek, Curator & Senior Manager Computer History Museum 1401 N. Shoreline Blvd., Mountain View, CA 94043 Phone: +1 650 810 1894 Twitter: @awbchm
Thank you all for your many suggestions. IT History Society One Blackfield Drive Suite 331 Tiburon, CA 94920 (415) 435-2263 info@ITHistory.org www.ITHistory.org Ensuring the Future by Preserving the Past -----Original Message----- From: members-bounces@sigcis.org [mailto:members-bounces@sigcis.org] On Behalf Of Evan Koblentz Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2012 5:29 AM To: members@sigcis.org Subject: Re: [SIGCIS-Members] Older computers (1940-1950)
If we include the ABC, we may as well add Couffignal's computer, an electronic, parallel calculator programmed from an external disk.
I agree about ABC being of a different, lesser class than the others on the list. Hadn't heard of Couffignal, very interesting! _______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members@sigcis.org, the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://sigcis.org/pipermail/members/ and you can change your subscription options at http://sigcis.org/mailman/listinfo/members
Hi all, I am not sure why this discussion thread seems to be going out of its way to degrade the importance of the ABC machine. The computer was conceived in the late 1930s and became operational in 1942. Granted, it was not a general purpose machine, as some of the other machines on the list. However, it is generally acknowledged to be the first electronic special purpose computer. Furthermore, in the protracted court case with the ENIAC on the patent of the computer, the ABC prevailed. It may be worthwhile to visit the URL http://jva.cs.iastate.edu/operation.php , and see the birthplace of the ABC. Thanks for your consideration. John John Impagliazzo, Ph.D. Professor Emeritus, Hofstra University IEEE Life Fellow; ACM Distinguished Educator Editor-in-Chief, ACM Inroads From: members-bounces@sigcis.org [mailto:members-bounces@sigcis.org] On Behalf Of Info @ IT History Society Sent: 15 November, 2012 10:38 To: members@sigcis.org Subject: Re: [SIGCIS-Members] Older computers (1940-1950) Thank you all for your many suggestions. IT History Society One Blackfield Drive - Suite 331 Tiburon, CA 94920 (415) 435-2263 info@ITHistory.org www.ITHistory.org Ensuring the Future by Preserving the Past -----Original Message----- From: members-bounces@sigcis.org [members-bounces@sigcis.org<mailto:members-bounces@sigcis.org>] On Behalf Of Evan Koblentz Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2012 5:29 AM To: members@sigcis.org Subject: Re: [SIGCIS-Members] Older computers (1940-1950) If we include the ABC, we may as well add Couffignal's computer, an electronic, parallel calculator programmed from an external disk. I agree about ABC being of a different, lesser class than the others on the list. Hadn't heard of Couffignal, very interesting! _____________________________________________ This email is relayed from members@sigcis.org, the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://sigcis.org/pipermail/members/<http://u106606.sendgrid.org/wf/click?upn=IPmPVXIROh4HhT-2BgIUm4dk-2F6Jh-2BQ6aVw5zehLLQHY2K8innD91vZk0GUD5PpoJAE_4xVQBtoGnN5VhnDrGAOcP-2F9CWH2EGm4lBCc4YOumtqmdQsrrydYf7BNtUHI-2FqBb5GCUJ07imDKs2iuVKnyU8biKizhmleJXwFi1QH0tB5ImxqbkRN56lD90XcZtfQkAOygtDdS0JULQNPAftlRS0n-2FIyHm-2F46WCB0O1s-2Buulldc-3D> and you can change your subscription options at http://sigcis.org/mailman/listinfo/members<http://u106606.sendgrid.org/wf/click?upn=IPmPVXIROh4HhT-2BgIUm4djOjKkVnTZko2gpOY1od3fJgTAJ3w2o9FDsUt62qKisgujY4WwTOri7SMCY8SggBWQ-3D-3D_4xVQBtoGnN5VhnDrGAOcP-2F9CWH2EGm4lBCc4YOumtqmdQsrrydYf7BNtUHI-2FqBb5xPSRzNvXXfvO7DO2jyuXYJcvMPHytr0eERH1S6As2IaOCrNReLZJ6UOgMVWk-2F8QzQZpvoeRVmIYrc4zDS2LisVnOnHVRoLfUvgjF8Cz4vWc-3D>
participants (6)
-
Alex Bochannek -
Ceruzzi, Paul -
Evan Koblentz -
Info ＠ IT History Society -
John Impagliazzo -
Pierre Mounier