What are some good articles addressing why Zuse, Aiken, Stibitz, etc. decided to use binary (or not)? -- Evan Koblentz New Jersey Institute of Technology - Senior Writer, Office of Communications and Marketing - Adjunct Instructor, Ying Wu College of Computing - Faculty/Staff Advisor, NJIT Lego Club evank@njit.edu (973) 596-3065 https://web.njit.edu/~evank
If "etc" includes Turing, he wrote in the ACE report in late 1945: "(ii) Use of the binary scale. The binary scale seems particularly well suited for electronic computation because of its simplicity and the fact that valve equipment can very easily produce and distinguish two sizes of pulse." Of course he wrote that after reading the EDVAC report, but as always with Turing he covered the whole topic in a few words. Regards Brian Carpenter On 08-Jul-23 04:33, Evan Koblentz via Members wrote:
What are some good articles addressing why Zuse, Aiken, Stibitz, etc. decided to use binary (or not)?
On 08-Jul-23 09:01, Brian E Carpenter wrote:
If "etc" includes Turing, he wrote in the ACE report in late 1945:
"(ii) Use of the binary scale. The binary scale seems particularly well suited for electronic computation because of its simplicity and the fact that valve equipment can very easily produce and distinguish two sizes of pulse."
Of course he wrote that after reading the EDVAC report, but as always with Turing he covered the whole topic in a few words.
To complete that, von Neumann indeed says the same thing (in more words, as always) in sections 5.1 and 5.2 of his EDVAC report. I think it would have been obvious to anyone who seriously tried to design a stored-program machine with the available technology - especially to anyone with experience of ENIAC ("each [decimal] digit required 36 vacuum tubes, 10 of which were the dual triodes"). Who first cleared their mind of decimal arithmetic in order to *see* the simplicity of all-binary is indeed an interesting question. Machines before EDVAC, inlcuding the Harvard Mk I, were blends of binary and decimal. I appreciate what Pierre Mounier-Kuhn wrote, but unfortunately neither Zuse nor Couffignal seem to have had influence on the ENIAC/EDVAC work and therefore on the mainstream. Regards Brian Carpenter
Regards Brian Carpenter
On 08-Jul-23 04:33, Evan Koblentz via Members wrote:
What are some good articles addressing why Zuse, Aiken, Stibitz, etc. decided to use binary (or not)?
In Raúl Rojas' paper on the Z1/Z3(1), he writes that "instead of using gears (as Babbage had done in the previous century), Zuse implemented logical and arithmetical operations using sliding metallic rods. The rods could move in only one of two directions (forward or backward) and therefore were appropriate for a binary machine." The Z1 is 1936-38. This doesn't quite explain if rods or binary arithmetic came first, but there is a footnote to Zuse's book "Der Computer mein Lebenswerk". As a side note, I can recommend seeing the Z1 in the Technical Museum in Berlin if you are near. Jesper Juul 1) https://ed-thelen.org/comp-hist/Zuse_Z1_and_Z3.pdf On Fri, 7 Jul 2023 at 18:34, Evan Koblentz via Members < members@lists.sigcis.org> wrote:
What are some good articles addressing why Zuse, Aiken, Stibitz, etc. decided to use binary (or not)?
-- Evan Koblentz
New Jersey Institute of Technology - Senior Writer, Office of Communications and Marketing - Adjunct Instructor, Ying Wu College of Computing - Faculty/Staff Advisor, NJIT Lego Club
evank@njit.edu (973) 596-3065 https://web.njit.edu/~evank
_______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members at sigcis.org, the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ and you can change your subscription options at http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org
Indeed a central question is "if rods or binary arithmetic came first" – whether choosing binary arithmetic was driven by technology or by mathematical ideas (basically Leibniz'). It was clear in Von Neumann's " First draft " (1945) that valves and trigger circuits "naturally" led to binary arithmetic, as a net progress from the decimal-based ENIAC. Yet, precisely, valves and trigger circuits had not led to binary arithmetic in the ENIAC. The change in technologies, from mechanical components to electrical relays and finally to valves, did not seem to determine the choice, but more likely to enable the switch to binary: Zuse's Z1 mechanical calculator, and simultaneously Couffignal's calculator project, seem to have been designed from the start as binary machines.Their next projects, using electrical relays, were binary as well, while Aiken in Harvard used the same technology to build decimal-based calculators. By the way, if we address this question now, hasn't it been studied years and perhaps decades ago by other historians or computer scientists ? Perhaps as a follow-on to Merritt Roe Smith's " Does Technology Drive History "? Best, Pierre De: "Jesper Juul via Members" <members@lists.sigcis.org> À: "Evan Koblentz" <evank@njit.edu> Cc: "members" <members@lists.sigcis.org> Envoyé: Samedi 8 Juillet 2023 14:05:11 Objet: Re: [SIGCIS-Members] Zuse / binary In Raúl Rojas' paper on the Z1/Z3(1), he writes that "instead of using gears (as Babbage had done in the previous century), Zuse implemented logical and arithmetical operations using sliding metallic rods. The rods could move in only one of two directions (forward or backward) and therefore were appropriate for a binary machine." The Z1 is 1936-38. This doesn't quite explain if rods or binary arithmetic came first, but there is a footnote to Zuse's book "Der Computer mein Lebenswerk". As a side note, I can recommend seeing the Z1 in the Technical Museum in Berlin if you are near. Jesper Juul 1) [ https://ed-thelen.org/comp-hist/Zuse_Z1_and_Z3.pdf | https://ed-thelen.org/comp-hist/Zuse_Z1_and_Z3.pdf ] On Fri, 7 Jul 2023 at 18:34, Evan Koblentz via Members < [ mailto:members@lists.sigcis.org | members@lists.sigcis.org ] > wrote: What are some good articles addressing why Zuse, Aiken, Stibitz, etc. decided to use binary (or not)? -- Evan Koblentz New Jersey Institute of Technology - Senior Writer, Office of Communications and Marketing - Adjunct Instructor, Ying Wu College of Computing - Faculty/Staff Advisor, NJIT Lego Club [ mailto:evank@njit.edu | evank@njit.edu ] (973) 596-3065 [ https://web.njit.edu/~evank | https://web.njit.edu/~evank ] _______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members at [ http://sigcis.org/ | sigcis.org ] , the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at [ http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ | http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ ] and you can change your subscription options at [ http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org | http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org ] _______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members at sigcis.org, the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ and you can change your subscription options at http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org
Indeed! Which came first? Reading an excerpt of Zuse's book, he explains that binary arithmetic bridged the gap between two methods of multiplication, repeated addition and multiplication tables, so this gives a motivation for using binary. Perhaps someone with better German skills and access to the whole book can see if there was an order to it. In the excerpt it looks like math and technology came as one package (machine translation follows): "Meanwhile, it was the year 1937, and our work had taken shape, requiring better financing. I made contact with the then manufacturer of specialized calculating machines, Dr.-Ing. Kurt Pannke. The first phone conversation with him was typical of the prevailing attitude in the field at the time. "I have been told," Dr. Pannke began, "that you have invented a calculating machine. Now, I don't want to discourage you from working as an inventor and developing new ideas. But there is something I must tell you from the outset: in the field of calculating machines, practically everything has been researched and refined to its fullest extent. There is hardly anything left to invent. This was also confirmed to me by the famous calculating machine designer Hamann, whose ideas have been used to build around a million calculating machines. Does your calculating machine work based on the principle of repeated addition or the principle of the multiplication table?" "It's the same in my machine," I said, and instead of an answer, there followed a longer pause. One must know that at that time the most important problem with calculating machines was multiplication. There were two schools, each advocating for one of the two principles mentioned. Most machines worked using repeated addition, meaning that the multiplicand was repeatedly added to the machine's register based on the selected digit of the multiplier. The more elegant method was undoubtedly the one using the multiplication table, where the partial products of the small multiplication table were directly represented using technical means and then added directly to the register. Unfortunately, this method was also the most expensive. Nowadays, hardly any calculator designers concern themselves with such matters. However, back then, each procedure was seen as a kind of worldview among peers. And now, a young man claimed that both methods were the same for him. Nevertheless, Dr. Pannke came to my workshop, and I was able to explain to him that in the binary number system, the multiplication table is reduced to four simple formulas: 0 x 0 = 0 0 x 1 = 0 1 x 0 = 0 1 x 1 = 1" Jesper Juul PS. https://web.archive.org/web/20140908180042/http://www.lmz-bw.de/fileadmin/us... On Sat, 8 Jul 2023 at 15:34, Pierre Mounier-Kuhn <mounier@msh-paris.fr> wrote:
Indeed a central question is "if rods or binary arithmetic came first" – whether choosing binary arithmetic was driven by technology or by mathematical ideas (basically Leibniz'). It was clear in Von Neumann's "*First draft*" (1945) that valves and trigger circuits "naturally" led to binary arithmetic, as a net progress from the decimal-based ENIAC. Yet, precisely, valves and trigger circuits had not led to binary arithmetic in the ENIAC.
The change in technologies, from mechanical components to electrical relays and finally to valves, did not seem to determine the choice, but more likely to *enable* the switch to binary: Zuse's Z1 mechanical calculator, and simultaneously Couffignal's calculator project, seem to have been designed from the start as binary machines.Their next projects, using electrical relays, were binary as well, while Aiken in Harvard used the same technology to build decimal-based calculators.
By the way, if we address this question now, hasn't it been studied years and perhaps decades ago by other historians or computer scientists ? Perhaps as a follow-on to Merritt Roe Smith's "*Does Technology Drive History*"?
Best, Pierre
------------------------------ *De: *"Jesper Juul via Members" <members@lists.sigcis.org> *À: *"Evan Koblentz" <evank@njit.edu> *Cc: *"members" <members@lists.sigcis.org> *Envoyé: *Samedi 8 Juillet 2023 14:05:11 *Objet: *Re: [SIGCIS-Members] Zuse / binary
In Raúl Rojas' paper on the Z1/Z3(1), he writes that "instead of using gears (as Babbage had done in the previous century), Zuse implemented logical and arithmetical operations using sliding metallic rods. The rods could move in only one of two directions (forward or backward) and therefore were appropriate for a binary machine." The Z1 is 1936-38.
This doesn't quite explain if rods or binary arithmetic came first, but there is a footnote to Zuse's book "Der Computer mein Lebenswerk".
As a side note, I can recommend seeing the Z1 in the Technical Museum in Berlin if you are near.
Jesper Juul
1) https://ed-thelen.org/comp-hist/Zuse_Z1_and_Z3.pdf
On Fri, 7 Jul 2023 at 18:34, Evan Koblentz via Members < members@lists.sigcis.org> wrote:
What are some good articles addressing why Zuse, Aiken, Stibitz, etc. decided to use binary (or not)?
-- Evan Koblentz
New Jersey Institute of Technology - Senior Writer, Office of Communications and Marketing - Adjunct Instructor, Ying Wu College of Computing - Faculty/Staff Advisor, NJIT Lego Club
evank@njit.edu (973) 596-3065 https://web.njit.edu/~evank
_______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members at sigcis.org, the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ and you can change your subscription options at http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org
_______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members at sigcis.org, the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ and you can change your subscription options at http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org
Fascinating discussion. Zuse told me that he was taught binary arithmetic in grade school, but he only learned of Leibniz's essay on binary (ca. 1680) after Zuse began work on computers. Babbage was an admirer of Leibniz's work but did not consider binary for his engines. The Z1, which had a binary calculating unit, did not work well, and therefore Zuse adopted electromagnetic relays (a technology not available to Babbage) for his later machines, which did work. Attempts to reconstruct the Z1 for the Deutsches Technikmuseum using late 20th-Century machine tools also failed -- please correct me if I am mistaken. But note that Zuse built a successful mecahnical binary memory unit for the Z4, which not only worked well but which was in steady service at the ETH in Switzerland for years. The joke was that the clicking of the Z4 relays was the loudest noise in Zurich on any given evening. The Z4 is now at the Deutsches Museum in Munich. Paul Ceruzzi ________________________________ From: Members <members-bounces@lists.sigcis.org> on behalf of Jesper Juul via Members <members@lists.sigcis.org> Sent: Saturday, July 8, 2023 8:05 AM To: Evan Koblentz <evank@njit.edu> Cc: members@lists.sigcis.org <members@lists.sigcis.org> Subject: Re: [SIGCIS-Members] Zuse / binary External Email - Exercise Caution In Raúl Rojas' paper on the Z1/Z3(1), he writes that "instead of using gears (as Babbage had done in the previous century), Zuse implemented logical and arithmetical operations using sliding metallic rods. The rods could move in only one of two directions (forward or backward) and therefore were appropriate for a binary machine." The Z1 is 1936-38. This doesn't quite explain if rods or binary arithmetic came first, but there is a footnote to Zuse's book "Der Computer mein Lebenswerk". As a side note, I can recommend seeing the Z1 in the Technical Museum in Berlin if you are near. Jesper Juul 1) https://ed-thelen.org/comp-hist/Zuse_Z1_and_Z3.pdf On Fri, 7 Jul 2023 at 18:34, Evan Koblentz via Members <members@lists.sigcis.org<mailto:members@lists.sigcis.org>> wrote: What are some good articles addressing why Zuse, Aiken, Stibitz, etc. decided to use binary (or not)? -- Evan Koblentz New Jersey Institute of Technology - Senior Writer, Office of Communications and Marketing - Adjunct Instructor, Ying Wu College of Computing - Faculty/Staff Advisor, NJIT Lego Club evank@njit.edu<mailto:evank@njit.edu> (973) 596-3065 https://web.njit.edu/~evank _______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members at sigcis.org<http://sigcis.org/>, the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ and you can change your subscription options at http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org
Thanks everyone for this fascinating discussion. While I cannot offer any contribution to Zuse's decision to use binary notation, I do have an opinion to offer re: the decision to use binary rather than decimal notation with the EDVAC. In their 1945 report entitled "Automatic High Speed Computing: A Progress Report on the EDVAC," Eckert and Mauchly write that "accuracy is ensured by digital methods" (6) but, there is also an indication that the reliability of vacuum tubes is greatly increased by the use of "digital methods." All best, Johannah On Sat, Jul 8, 2023 at 12:43 PM Ceruzzi, Paul via Members < members@lists.sigcis.org> wrote:
Fascinating discussion. Zuse told me that he was taught binary arithmetic in grade school, but he only learned of Leibniz's essay on binary (ca. 1680) after Zuse began work on computers. Babbage was an admirer of Leibniz's work but did not consider binary for his engines. The Z1, which had a binary calculating unit, did not work well, and therefore Zuse adopted electromagnetic relays (a technology not available to Babbage) for his later machines, which did work. Attempts to reconstruct the Z1 for the Deutsches Technikmuseum using late 20th-Century machine tools also failed -- please correct me if I am mistaken. But note that Zuse built a successful mecahnical binary *memory* unit for the Z4, which not only worked well but which was in steady service at the ETH in Switzerland for years. The joke was that the clicking of the Z4 relays was the loudest noise in Zurich on any given evening. The Z4 is now at the Deutsches Museum in Munich.
Paul Ceruzzi ------------------------------ *From:* Members <members-bounces@lists.sigcis.org> on behalf of Jesper Juul via Members <members@lists.sigcis.org> *Sent:* Saturday, July 8, 2023 8:05 AM *To:* Evan Koblentz <evank@njit.edu> *Cc:* members@lists.sigcis.org <members@lists.sigcis.org> *Subject:* Re: [SIGCIS-Members] Zuse / binary
*External Email - Exercise Caution* In Raúl Rojas' paper on the Z1/Z3(1), he writes that "instead of using gears (as Babbage had done in the previous century), Zuse implemented logical and arithmetical operations using sliding metallic rods. The rods could move in only one of two directions (forward or backward) and therefore were appropriate for a binary machine." The Z1 is 1936-38.
This doesn't quite explain if rods or binary arithmetic came first, but there is a footnote to Zuse's book "Der Computer mein Lebenswerk".
As a side note, I can recommend seeing the Z1 in the Technical Museum in Berlin if you are near.
Jesper Juul
1) https://ed-thelen.org/comp-hist/Zuse_Z1_and_Z3.pdf
On Fri, 7 Jul 2023 at 18:34, Evan Koblentz via Members < members@lists.sigcis.org> wrote:
What are some good articles addressing why Zuse, Aiken, Stibitz, etc. decided to use binary (or not)?
-- Evan Koblentz
New Jersey Institute of Technology - Senior Writer, Office of Communications and Marketing - Adjunct Instructor, Ying Wu College of Computing - Faculty/Staff Advisor, NJIT Lego Club
evank@njit.edu (973) 596-3065 https://web.njit.edu/~evank
_______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members at sigcis.org, the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ and you can change your subscription options at http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org
_______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members at sigcis.org, the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ and you can change your subscription options at http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org
-- johannahrodgers@gmail.com www.johannahrodgers.net
On 09-Jul-23 05:23, Johannah Rodgers via Members wrote:
Thanks everyone for this fascinating discussion. While I cannot offer any contribution to Zuse's decision to use binary notation, I do have an opinion to offer re: the decision to use binary rather than decimal notation with the EDVAC. In their 1945 report entitled "Automatic High Speed Computing: A Progress Report on the EDVAC," Eckert and Mauchly write that "accuracy is ensured by digital methods" (6) but, there is also an indication that the reliability of vacuum tubes is greatly increased by the use of "digital methods."
Thanks for reminding me of that report. On the binary v. decimal point, it is interesting to contrast it with the von Neumann report. The progress report says: "In the EDVAC, the various digits specifying a number will be transmitted serially through a single channel. Switching equipment is consequently simplified and reduced. Moreover, the storage or memory elements to be used in the EDVAC are entirely different from those used in the ENIAC." [page 4] "Indeed, the EDVAC will store its operating instruc- tions in exactly the same manner as it stores numbers." [page 5] "For the purpose of this report, it was decided to present plans based on use of a coded decimal number representation, although a binary system may ultimately be used. The computer elements are therefore somewhat more com- plicated than they would be for a binary machine." [page 8] That was dated almost exactly 3 months later than the von Neumann report, which clearly states that the machine should be binary. An interesting discrepancy. I wonder whether the progress report was aimed at a somewhat conservative management chain? Or is this simply a reflection of von Neumann's status as a brilliant outsider? Regards, Brian Carpenter
All best,
Johannah
On Sat, Jul 8, 2023 at 12:43 PM Ceruzzi, Paul via Members <members@lists.sigcis.org <mailto:members@lists.sigcis.org>> wrote:
Fascinating discussion. Zuse told me that he was taught binary arithmetic in grade school, but he only learned of Leibniz's essay on binary (ca. 1680) after Zuse began work on computers. Babbage was an admirer of Leibniz's work but did not consider binary for his engines. The Z1, which had a binary calculating unit, did not work well, and therefore Zuse adopted electromagnetic relays (a technology not available to Babbage) for his later machines, which did work. Attempts to reconstruct the Z1 for the Deutsches Technikmuseum using late 20th-Century machine tools also failed -- please correct me if I am mistaken. But note that Zuse built a successful mecahnical binary /memory/ unit for the Z4, which not only worked well but which was in steady service at the ETH in Switzerland for years. The joke was that the clicking of the Z4 relays was the loudest noise in Zurich on any given evening. The Z4 is now at the Deutsches Museum in Munich.
Paul Ceruzzi ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ *From:* Members <members-bounces@lists.sigcis.org <mailto:members-bounces@lists.sigcis.org>> on behalf of Jesper Juul via Members <members@lists.sigcis.org <mailto:members@lists.sigcis.org>> *Sent:* Saturday, July 8, 2023 8:05 AM *To:* Evan Koblentz <evank@njit.edu <mailto:evank@njit.edu>> *Cc:* members@lists.sigcis.org <mailto:members@lists.sigcis.org> <members@lists.sigcis.org <mailto:members@lists.sigcis.org>> *Subject:* Re: [SIGCIS-Members] Zuse / binary
*External Email - Exercise Caution*
In Raúl Rojas' paper on the Z1/Z3(1), he writes that "instead of using gears (as Babbage had done in the previous century), Zuse implemented logical and arithmetical operations using sliding metallic rods. The rods could move in only one of two directions (forward or backward) and therefore were appropriate for a binary machine." The Z1 is 1936-38.
This doesn't quite explain if rods or binary arithmetic came first, but there is a footnote to Zuse's book "Der Computer mein Lebenswerk".
As a side note, I can recommend seeing the Z1 in the Technical Museum in Berlin if you are near.
Jesper Juul
1) https://ed-thelen.org/comp-hist/Zuse_Z1_and_Z3.pdf <https://ed-thelen.org/comp-hist/Zuse_Z1_and_Z3.pdf>
On Fri, 7 Jul 2023 at 18:34, Evan Koblentz via Members <members@lists.sigcis.org <mailto:members@lists.sigcis.org>> wrote:
What are some good articles addressing why Zuse, Aiken, Stibitz, etc. decided to use binary (or not)?
-- Evan Koblentz
New Jersey Institute of Technology - Senior Writer, Office of Communications and Marketing - Adjunct Instructor, Ying Wu College of Computing - Faculty/Staff Advisor, NJIT Lego Club
evank@njit.edu <mailto:evank@njit.edu> (973) 596-3065 https://web.njit.edu/~evank <https://web.njit.edu/~evank>
_______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members at sigcis.org <http://sigcis.org/>, the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ <http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/> and you can change your subscription options at http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org <http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org>
_______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members at sigcis.org <http://sigcis.org>, the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ <http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/> and you can change your subscription options at http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org <http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org>
-- johannahrodgers@gmail.com <mailto:johannahrodgers@gmail.com> www.johannahrodgers.net <http://www.johannahrodgers.net>
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Hi all It's worth remembering that von Neumann mailed the text of the *First Draft* to Herman Goldstine at the end of April 1945, around two months before the June 30 date that we are familiar with from the mimeographed version. On May 8 he followed up with a long letter which included additional material to be added to the report (it never was). A lot of this material concerns input and output: von Neumann was concerned that long binary strings are unfamiliar to operators, and proposed a binary-coded decimal scheme for input. Instructions were to be punched on a special-purpose keyboard with dedicated symbols corresponding to those in EDVAC's order code. Of course, binary-coded input would require translation into binary, so there are trade-offs involved, the effects of which may not have been obvious a priori. Presumably Eckert and Mauchly are just exploring these trade-offs by considering a binary-coded machine in detail - had anyone done this before? They don't seem to have be committed to one or the other ("a binary system may ultimately be used"). But importantly, they are concerned with the overall economy of using the machine, not just with the narrower question of whether binary is in some sense "simpler". So on p71, for example, they write "the ease with which a problem may be arranged for computation and the desired instructions placed on magnetic wire or tape is a very important factor in the design of the EDVAC". They go on to say that it's important that all the symbols used should appear on a standard typewriter - presumably a direct riposte to von Neumann's proposal! Best wishes Mark Dr Mark Priestley www.markpriestley.net Senior Research Fellow The National Museum of Computing Bletchley Park, UK https://www.tnmoc.org <http://www.markpriestley.net> On Sun, 9 Jul 2023 at 05:19, Brian E Carpenter via Members < members@lists.sigcis.org> wrote:
Thanks everyone for this fascinating discussion. While I cannot offer any contribution to Zuse's decision to use binary notation, I do have an opinion to offer re: the decision to use binary rather than decimal notation with the EDVAC. In their 1945 report entitled "Automatic High Speed Computing: A Progress Report on the EDVAC," Eckert and Mauchly write
On 09-Jul-23 05:23, Johannah Rodgers via Members wrote: that "accuracy is ensured by digital methods" (6) but, there is also an indication that the reliability of vacuum tubes is greatly increased by the use of "digital methods."
Thanks for reminding me of that report. On the binary v. decimal point, it is interesting to contrast it with the von Neumann report. The progress report says:
"In the EDVAC, the various digits specifying a number will be transmitted serially through a single channel. Switching equipment is consequently simplified and reduced. Moreover, the storage or memory elements to be used in the EDVAC are entirely different from those used in the ENIAC." [page 4]
"Indeed, the EDVAC will store its operating instruc- tions in exactly the same manner as it stores numbers." [page 5]
"For the purpose of this report, it was decided to present plans based on use of a coded decimal number representation, although a binary system may ultimately be used. The computer elements are therefore somewhat more com- plicated than they would be for a binary machine." [page 8]
That was dated almost exactly 3 months later than the von Neumann report, which clearly states that the machine should be binary. An interesting discrepancy. I wonder whether the progress report was aimed at a somewhat conservative management chain? Or is this simply a reflection of von Neumann's status as a brilliant outsider?
Regards, Brian Carpenter
All best,
Johannah
On Sat, Jul 8, 2023 at 12:43 PM Ceruzzi, Paul via Members <
members@lists.sigcis.org <mailto:members@lists.sigcis.org>> wrote:
Fascinating discussion. Zuse told me that he was taught binary
arithmetic in grade school, but he only learned of Leibniz's essay on binary (ca. 1680) after Zuse began work on computers. Babbage was an admirer of Leibniz's work but did not consider binary for his engines. The Z1, which had a binary calculating unit, did not work well, and therefore Zuse adopted electromagnetic relays (a technology not available to Babbage) for his later machines, which did work. Attempts to reconstruct the Z1 for the Deutsches Technikmuseum using late 20th-Century machine tools also failed -- please correct me if I am mistaken. But note that Zuse built a successful mecahnical binary /memory/ unit for the Z4, which not only worked well but which was in steady service at the ETH in Switzerland for years. The joke was that the clicking of the Z4 relays was the loudest noise in Zurich on any given evening. The Z4 is now at the Deutsches Museum in Munich.
Paul Ceruzzi
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
*From:* Members <members-bounces@lists.sigcis.org <mailto:
members-bounces@lists.sigcis.org>> on behalf of Jesper Juul via Members < members@lists.sigcis.org <mailto:members@lists.sigcis.org>>
*Sent:* Saturday, July 8, 2023 8:05 AM *To:* Evan Koblentz <evank@njit.edu <mailto:evank@njit.edu>> *Cc:* members@lists.sigcis.org <mailto:members@lists.sigcis.org> <
members@lists.sigcis.org <mailto:members@lists.sigcis.org>>
*Subject:* Re: [SIGCIS-Members] Zuse / binary
*External Email - Exercise Caution*
In Raúl Rojas' paper on the Z1/Z3(1), he writes that "instead of
using gears (as Babbage had done in the previous century), Zuse implemented logical and arithmetical operations using sliding metallic rods. The rods could move in only one of two directions (forward or backward) and therefore were appropriate for a binary machine." The Z1 is 1936-38.
This doesn't quite explain if rods or binary arithmetic came first,
but there is a footnote to Zuse's book "Der Computer mein Lebenswerk".
As a side note, I can recommend seeing the Z1 in the Technical
Museum in Berlin if you are near.
Jesper Juul
https://ed-thelen.org/comp-hist/Zuse_Z1_and_Z3.pdf>
On Fri, 7 Jul 2023 at 18:34, Evan Koblentz via Members <
members@lists.sigcis.org <mailto:members@lists.sigcis.org>> wrote:
What are some good articles addressing why Zuse, Aiken, Stibitz,
etc.
decided to use binary (or not)?
-- Evan Koblentz
New Jersey Institute of Technology - Senior Writer, Office of Communications and Marketing - Adjunct Instructor, Ying Wu College of Computing - Faculty/Staff Advisor, NJIT Lego Club
evank@njit.edu <mailto:evank@njit.edu> (973) 596-3065 https://web.njit.edu/~evank <https://web.njit.edu/~evank>
_______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members at sigcis.org <
http://sigcis.org/>, the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ < http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/> and you can change your subscription options at http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org < http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org>
_______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members at sigcis.org <http://sigcis.org>,
the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ < http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/> and you can change your subscription options at http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org < http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org>
-- johannahrodgers@gmail.com <mailto:johannahrodgers@gmail.com> www.johannahrodgers.net <http://www.johannahrodgers.net>
_______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members at sigcis.org, the email discussion
list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ and you can change your subscription options at http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org _______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members at sigcis.org, the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ and you can change your subscription options at http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org
Thank you, Mark! Not having been aware of this von Neumann letter, my reading of the "First Draft" and of the "EDVAC Progress Report" with regard to the decision to use binary notation would indicate that the technical affordances of various components far outweighed consideration of human usability and legibility. Now that I know about this von Neumann letter--is this in the APA archive or published somewhere?--I will look forward to integrating that into the mix. All best, Johannah On Sun, Jul 9, 2023 at 9:26 AM Mark Priestley via Members < members@lists.sigcis.org> wrote:
Hi all
It's worth remembering that von Neumann mailed the text of the *First Draft* to Herman Goldstine at the end of April 1945, around two months before the June 30 date that we are familiar with from the mimeographed version. On May 8 he followed up with a long letter which included additional material to be added to the report (it never was). A lot of this material concerns input and output: von Neumann was concerned that long binary strings are unfamiliar to operators, and proposed a binary-coded decimal scheme for input. Instructions were to be punched on a special-purpose keyboard with dedicated symbols corresponding to those in EDVAC's order code.
Of course, binary-coded input would require translation into binary, so there are trade-offs involved, the effects of which may not have been obvious a priori. Presumably Eckert and Mauchly are just exploring these trade-offs by considering a binary-coded machine in detail - had anyone done this before? They don't seem to have be committed to one or the other ("a binary system may ultimately be used"). But importantly, they are concerned with the overall economy of using the machine, not just with the narrower question of whether binary is in some sense "simpler". So on p71, for example, they write "the ease with which a problem may be arranged for computation and the desired instructions placed on magnetic wire or tape is a very important factor in the design of the EDVAC". They go on to say that it's important that all the symbols used should appear on a standard typewriter - presumably a direct riposte to von Neumann's proposal!
Best wishes Mark
Dr Mark Priestley www.markpriestley.net
Senior Research Fellow The National Museum of Computing Bletchley Park, UK https://www.tnmoc.org <http://www.markpriestley.net>
On Sun, 9 Jul 2023 at 05:19, Brian E Carpenter via Members < members@lists.sigcis.org> wrote:
Thanks everyone for this fascinating discussion. While I cannot offer any contribution to Zuse's decision to use binary notation, I do have an opinion to offer re: the decision to use binary rather than decimal notation with the EDVAC. In their 1945 report entitled "Automatic High Speed Computing: A Progress Report on the EDVAC," Eckert and Mauchly write
On 09-Jul-23 05:23, Johannah Rodgers via Members wrote: that "accuracy is ensured by digital methods" (6) but, there is also an indication that the reliability of vacuum tubes is greatly increased by the use of "digital methods."
Thanks for reminding me of that report. On the binary v. decimal point, it is interesting to contrast it with the von Neumann report. The progress report says:
"In the EDVAC, the various digits specifying a number will be transmitted serially through a single channel. Switching equipment is consequently simplified and reduced. Moreover, the storage or memory elements to be used in the EDVAC are entirely different from those used in the ENIAC." [page 4]
"Indeed, the EDVAC will store its operating instruc- tions in exactly the same manner as it stores numbers." [page 5]
"For the purpose of this report, it was decided to present plans based on use of a coded decimal number representation, although a binary system may ultimately be used. The computer elements are therefore somewhat more com- plicated than they would be for a binary machine." [page 8]
That was dated almost exactly 3 months later than the von Neumann report, which clearly states that the machine should be binary. An interesting discrepancy. I wonder whether the progress report was aimed at a somewhat conservative management chain? Or is this simply a reflection of von Neumann's status as a brilliant outsider?
Regards, Brian Carpenter
All best,
Johannah
On Sat, Jul 8, 2023 at 12:43 PM Ceruzzi, Paul via Members <
members@lists.sigcis.org <mailto:members@lists.sigcis.org>> wrote:
Fascinating discussion. Zuse told me that he was taught binary
arithmetic in grade school, but he only learned of Leibniz's essay on binary (ca. 1680) after Zuse began work on computers. Babbage was an admirer of Leibniz's work but did not consider binary for his engines. The Z1, which had a binary calculating unit, did not work well, and therefore Zuse adopted electromagnetic relays (a technology not available to Babbage) for his later machines, which did work. Attempts to reconstruct the Z1 for the Deutsches Technikmuseum using late 20th-Century machine tools also failed -- please correct me if I am mistaken. But note that Zuse built a successful mecahnical binary /memory/ unit for the Z4, which not only worked well but which was in steady service at the ETH in Switzerland for years. The joke was that the clicking of the Z4 relays was the loudest noise in Zurich on any given evening. The Z4 is now at the Deutsches Museum in Munich.
Paul Ceruzzi
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
*From:* Members <members-bounces@lists.sigcis.org <mailto:
members-bounces@lists.sigcis.org>> on behalf of Jesper Juul via Members < members@lists.sigcis.org <mailto:members@lists.sigcis.org>>
*Sent:* Saturday, July 8, 2023 8:05 AM *To:* Evan Koblentz <evank@njit.edu <mailto:evank@njit.edu>> *Cc:* members@lists.sigcis.org <mailto:members@lists.sigcis.org> <
members@lists.sigcis.org <mailto:members@lists.sigcis.org>>
*Subject:* Re: [SIGCIS-Members] Zuse / binary
*External Email - Exercise Caution*
In Raúl Rojas' paper on the Z1/Z3(1), he writes that "instead of
using gears (as Babbage had done in the previous century), Zuse implemented logical and arithmetical operations using sliding metallic rods. The rods could move in only one of two directions (forward or backward) and therefore were appropriate for a binary machine." The Z1 is 1936-38.
This doesn't quite explain if rods or binary arithmetic came first,
but there is a footnote to Zuse's book "Der Computer mein Lebenswerk".
As a side note, I can recommend seeing the Z1 in the Technical
Museum in Berlin if you are near.
Jesper Juul
https://ed-thelen.org/comp-hist/Zuse_Z1_and_Z3.pdf>
On Fri, 7 Jul 2023 at 18:34, Evan Koblentz via Members <
members@lists.sigcis.org <mailto:members@lists.sigcis.org>> wrote:
What are some good articles addressing why Zuse, Aiken,
Stibitz, etc.
decided to use binary (or not)?
-- Evan Koblentz
New Jersey Institute of Technology - Senior Writer, Office of Communications and Marketing - Adjunct Instructor, Ying Wu College of Computing - Faculty/Staff Advisor, NJIT Lego Club
evank@njit.edu <mailto:evank@njit.edu> (973) 596-3065 https://web.njit.edu/~evank <https://web.njit.edu/~evank>
_______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members at sigcis.org <
http://sigcis.org/>, the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ < http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/> and you can change your subscription options at http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org < http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org>
_______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members at sigcis.org <http://sigcis.org>,
the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ < http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/> and you can change your subscription options at http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org < http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org>
-- johannahrodgers@gmail.com <mailto:johannahrodgers@gmail.com> www.johannahrodgers.net <http://www.johannahrodgers.net>
_______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members at sigcis.org, the email discussion
list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ and you can change your subscription options at http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org _______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members at sigcis.org, the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ and you can change your subscription options at http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org
_______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members at sigcis.org, the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ and you can change your subscription options at http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org
-- johannahrodgers@gmail.com www.johannahrodgers.net
Hi Johannah - As far as I know the letter hasn't been published, though there are references to it in the literature. There's a typed copy in Herman Goldstine's papers at the APS. Goldstine sent von Neumann's original manuscript (of the First Draft) back to Valentine Bargmann at Princeton, as JvN was in Los Alamos at the time. I contacted Princeton last year to see if there was any sign of it in Bargmann's papers. The archivist I was talking to said no, but did turn up the autograph of the May 8 letter instead, which was a nice consolation prize! All the best Mark On Sun, 9 Jul 2023 at 14:45, Johannah Rodgers <johannah.rodgers@gmail.com> wrote:
Thank you, Mark! Not having been aware of this von Neumann letter, my reading of the "First Draft" and of the "EDVAC Progress Report" with regard to the decision to use binary notation would indicate that the technical affordances of various components far outweighed consideration of human usability and legibility. Now that I know about this von Neumann letter--is this in the APA archive or published somewhere?--I will look forward to integrating that into the mix.
All best,
Johannah
On Sun, Jul 9, 2023 at 9:26 AM Mark Priestley via Members < members@lists.sigcis.org> wrote:
Hi all
It's worth remembering that von Neumann mailed the text of the *First Draft* to Herman Goldstine at the end of April 1945, around two months before the June 30 date that we are familiar with from the mimeographed version. On May 8 he followed up with a long letter which included additional material to be added to the report (it never was). A lot of this material concerns input and output: von Neumann was concerned that long binary strings are unfamiliar to operators, and proposed a binary-coded decimal scheme for input. Instructions were to be punched on a special-purpose keyboard with dedicated symbols corresponding to those in EDVAC's order code.
Of course, binary-coded input would require translation into binary, so there are trade-offs involved, the effects of which may not have been obvious a priori. Presumably Eckert and Mauchly are just exploring these trade-offs by considering a binary-coded machine in detail - had anyone done this before? They don't seem to have be committed to one or the other ("a binary system may ultimately be used"). But importantly, they are concerned with the overall economy of using the machine, not just with the narrower question of whether binary is in some sense "simpler". So on p71, for example, they write "the ease with which a problem may be arranged for computation and the desired instructions placed on magnetic wire or tape is a very important factor in the design of the EDVAC". They go on to say that it's important that all the symbols used should appear on a standard typewriter - presumably a direct riposte to von Neumann's proposal!
Best wishes Mark
Dr Mark Priestley www.markpriestley.net
Senior Research Fellow The National Museum of Computing Bletchley Park, UK https://www.tnmoc.org <http://www.markpriestley.net>
On Sun, 9 Jul 2023 at 05:19, Brian E Carpenter via Members < members@lists.sigcis.org> wrote:
Thanks everyone for this fascinating discussion. While I cannot offer any contribution to Zuse's decision to use binary notation, I do have an opinion to offer re: the decision to use binary rather than decimal notation with the EDVAC. In their 1945 report entitled "Automatic High Speed Computing: A Progress Report on the EDVAC," Eckert and Mauchly write
On 09-Jul-23 05:23, Johannah Rodgers via Members wrote: that "accuracy is ensured by digital methods" (6) but, there is also an indication that the reliability of vacuum tubes is greatly increased by the use of "digital methods."
Thanks for reminding me of that report. On the binary v. decimal point, it is interesting to contrast it with the von Neumann report. The progress report says:
"In the EDVAC, the various digits specifying a number will be transmitted serially through a single channel. Switching equipment is consequently simplified and reduced. Moreover, the storage or memory elements to be used in the EDVAC are entirely different from those used in the ENIAC." [page 4]
"Indeed, the EDVAC will store its operating instruc- tions in exactly the same manner as it stores numbers." [page 5]
"For the purpose of this report, it was decided to present plans based on use of a coded decimal number representation, although a binary system may ultimately be used. The computer elements are therefore somewhat more com- plicated than they would be for a binary machine." [page 8]
That was dated almost exactly 3 months later than the von Neumann report, which clearly states that the machine should be binary. An interesting discrepancy. I wonder whether the progress report was aimed at a somewhat conservative management chain? Or is this simply a reflection of von Neumann's status as a brilliant outsider?
Regards, Brian Carpenter
All best,
Johannah
On Sat, Jul 8, 2023 at 12:43 PM Ceruzzi, Paul via Members <
members@lists.sigcis.org <mailto:members@lists.sigcis.org>> wrote:
Fascinating discussion. Zuse told me that he was taught binary
arithmetic in grade school, but he only learned of Leibniz's essay on binary (ca. 1680) after Zuse began work on computers. Babbage was an admirer of Leibniz's work but did not consider binary for his engines. The Z1, which had a binary calculating unit, did not work well, and therefore Zuse adopted electromagnetic relays (a technology not available to Babbage) for his later machines, which did work. Attempts to reconstruct the Z1 for the Deutsches Technikmuseum using late 20th-Century machine tools also failed -- please correct me if I am mistaken. But note that Zuse built a successful mecahnical binary /memory/ unit for the Z4, which not only worked well but which was in steady service at the ETH in Switzerland for years. The joke was that the clicking of the Z4 relays was the loudest noise in Zurich on any given evening. The Z4 is now at the Deutsches Museum in Munich.
Paul Ceruzzi
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
*From:* Members <members-bounces@lists.sigcis.org <mailto:
members-bounces@lists.sigcis.org>> on behalf of Jesper Juul via Members <members@lists.sigcis.org <mailto:members@lists.sigcis.org>>
*Sent:* Saturday, July 8, 2023 8:05 AM *To:* Evan Koblentz <evank@njit.edu <mailto:evank@njit.edu>> *Cc:* members@lists.sigcis.org <mailto:members@lists.sigcis.org> <
members@lists.sigcis.org <mailto:members@lists.sigcis.org>>
*Subject:* Re: [SIGCIS-Members] Zuse / binary
*External Email - Exercise Caution*
In Raúl Rojas' paper on the Z1/Z3(1), he writes that "instead of
using gears (as Babbage had done in the previous century), Zuse implemented logical and arithmetical operations using sliding metallic rods. The rods could move in only one of two directions (forward or backward) and therefore were appropriate for a binary machine." The Z1 is 1936-38.
This doesn't quite explain if rods or binary arithmetic came
first, but there is a footnote to Zuse's book "Der Computer mein Lebenswerk".
As a side note, I can recommend seeing the Z1 in the Technical
Museum in Berlin if you are near.
Jesper Juul
https://ed-thelen.org/comp-hist/Zuse_Z1_and_Z3.pdf>
On Fri, 7 Jul 2023 at 18:34, Evan Koblentz via Members <
members@lists.sigcis.org <mailto:members@lists.sigcis.org>> wrote:
What are some good articles addressing why Zuse, Aiken,
Stibitz, etc.
decided to use binary (or not)?
-- Evan Koblentz
New Jersey Institute of Technology - Senior Writer, Office of Communications and Marketing - Adjunct Instructor, Ying Wu College of Computing - Faculty/Staff Advisor, NJIT Lego Club
evank@njit.edu <mailto:evank@njit.edu> (973) 596-3065 https://web.njit.edu/~evank <https://web.njit.edu/~evank>
_______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members at sigcis.org <
http://sigcis.org/>, the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ < http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/> and you can change your subscription options at http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org < http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org>
_______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members at sigcis.org <
http://sigcis.org>, the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ < http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/> and you can change your subscription options at http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org < http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org>
-- johannahrodgers@gmail.com <mailto:johannahrodgers@gmail.com> www.johannahrodgers.net <http://www.johannahrodgers.net>
_______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members at sigcis.org, the email
discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ and you can change your subscription options at http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org _______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members at sigcis.org, the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ and you can change your subscription options at http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org
_______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members at sigcis.org, the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ and you can change your subscription options at http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org
-- johannahrodgers@gmail.com www.johannahrodgers.net
Hi Paul: This correspondence causes me to recall that in the early 1970s, when I was arranging to have several of Zuse’s and Schreyer’s papers translated into English, for inclusion in my book “The Origins of Digital Computers” (Springer Verlag, 1973), I was very intrigued by Zuse’s “Mechanical Switching Element”, as portrayed in Figure 2 of his 1962 paper “Entwicklungslinien einer Rechengeräte-Entwicklung von der Mechanik zur Elektronic” (“The Outline of a Computer Development from Mechanics to Electronics”). So, I constructed a model Mechanical Switching Element out of little glued-together sheets of clear perspex (the largest of which were about 3.3cm x 1.3cm x 0.1cm), plus a 0.6cm-long floating metal rod (part of a gramophone needle). This model closely matched the scale of the diagram Zuse had provided in his paper – I didn’t and don’t know the dimensions of his actual switching elements. Despite my limited mechanical skills, the model switching element worked very well, and being transparent its operation was easily demonstrated. I used to keep it in my shirt pocket and show it off whenever the opportunity presented itself. Unfortunately, I lost the little model many years ago. Each time I look at Figure 2 I regret this loss! 😊 Cheers Brian From: Members <members-bounces@lists.sigcis.org> on behalf of "Ceruzzi, Paul via Members" <members@lists.sigcis.org> Reply to: Paul Ceruzzi <CeruzziP@si.edu> Date: Saturday, 8 July 2023 at 17:44 To: Evan Koblentz <evank@njit.edu>, Jesper Juul <j@jesperjuul.net> Cc: "members@lists.sigcis.org" <members@lists.sigcis.org> Subject: Re: [SIGCIS-Members] Zuse / binary Fascinating discussion. Zuse told me that he was taught binary arithmetic in grade school, but he only learned of Leibniz's essay on binary (ca. 1680) after Zuse began work on computers. Babbage was an admirer of Leibniz's work but did not consider binary for his engines. The Z1, which had a binary calculating unit, did not work well, and therefore Zuse adopted electromagnetic relays (a technology not available to Babbage) for his later machines, which did work. Attempts to reconstruct the Z1 for the Deutsches Technikmuseum using late 20th-Century machine tools also failed -- please correct me if I am mistaken. But note that Zuse built a successful mecahnical binary memory unit for the Z4, which not only worked well but which was in steady service at the ETH in Switzerland for years. The joke was that the clicking of the Z4 relays was the loudest noise in Zurich on any given evening. The Z4 is now at the Deutsches Museum in Munich. Paul Ceruzzi ________________________________ From: Members <members-bounces@lists.sigcis.org> on behalf of Jesper Juul via Members <members@lists.sigcis.org> Sent: Saturday, July 8, 2023 8:05 AM To: Evan Koblentz <evank@njit.edu> Cc: members@lists.sigcis.org <members@lists.sigcis.org> Subject: Re: [SIGCIS-Members] Zuse / binary External Email - Exercise Caution In Raúl Rojas' paper on the Z1/Z3(1), he writes that "instead of using gears (as Babbage had done in the previous century), Zuse implemented logical and arithmetical operations using sliding metallic rods. The rods could move in only one of two directions (forward or backward) and therefore were appropriate for a binary machine." The Z1 is 1936-38. This doesn't quite explain if rods or binary arithmetic came first, but there is a footnote to Zuse's book "Der Computer mein Lebenswerk". As a side note, I can recommend seeing the Z1 in the Technical Museum in Berlin if you are near. Jesper Juul 1) https://ed-thelen.org/comp-hist/Zuse_Z1_and_Z3.pdf On Fri, 7 Jul 2023 at 18:34, Evan Koblentz via Members <members@lists.sigcis.org<mailto:members@lists.sigcis.org>> wrote: What are some good articles addressing why Zuse, Aiken, Stibitz, etc. decided to use binary (or not)? -- Evan Koblentz New Jersey Institute of Technology - Senior Writer, Office of Communications and Marketing - Adjunct Instructor, Ying Wu College of Computing - Faculty/Staff Advisor, NJIT Lego Club evank@njit.edu<mailto:evank@njit.edu> (973) 596-3065 https://web.njit.edu/~evank _______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members at sigcis.org<http://sigcis.org/>, the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ and you can change your subscription options at http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org
Hi Paul and Brian: The Z4 was in operation at ETH Zurich from 1950 to 1955. However, contrary to Zuse's claims, it did not always work perfectly. There is a contemporary witness report on this subject by Urs Hochstrasser. You can find detailed information about Zuse's computers in my books: Bruderer, Herbert [2012]: Konrad Zuse und die Schweiz, De Gruyter Oldenbourg, Berlin/Boston, 1. Auflage 2012, 250 Seiten, http://www.degruyter.com/view/product/224272 Bruderer, Herbert [2020a]: Meilensteine der Rechentechnik, De Gruyter Oldenbourg, Berlin/Boston, 3. Auflage 2020, Band 1, 970 Seiten, 577 Abbildungen, 114 Tabellen, https://www.degruyter.com/view/title/567028?rskey=xoRERF&result=7 Bruderer, Herbert [2020b]: Meilensteine der Rechentechnik, De Gruyter Oldenbourg, Berlin/Boston, 3. Auflage 2020, Band 2, 1055 Seiten, 138 Abbildungen, 37 Tabellen, https://www.degruyter.com/view/title/567221?rskey=A8Y4Gb&result=4 Bruderer, Herbert [2020c]: Milestones in Analog and Digital Computing, Springer Nature Switzerland AG, Cham, 3rd edition 2020, 2 volumes, 2113 pages, 715 illustrations, 151 tables, translated from the German by John McMinn, https://www.springer.com/de/book/9783030409739 Best, Herbert ----Ursprüngliche Nachricht---- Von : members@lists.sigcis.org Datum : 08/07/2023 - 21:55 (MS) An : CeruzziP@si.edu, evank@njit.edu, j@jesperjuul.net Cc : members@lists.sigcis.org Betreff : Re: [SIGCIS-Members] Zuse / binary p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal { margin: 0.0cm; font-size: 11.0pt; font-family: Calibri , sans-serif; } a:link, span.MsoHyperlink { mso-style-priority: 99; color: blue; text-decoration: underline; } p.xmsonormal, li.xmsonormal, div.xmsonormal { mso-style-name: x_msonormal; margin: 0.0cm; font-size: 11.0pt; font-family: Calibri , sans-serif; } span.EmailStyle20 { mso-style-type: personal-reply; font-family: Calibri , sans-serif; color: windowtext; } *.MsoChpDefault { mso-style-type: export-only; font-size: 10.0pt; mso-ligatures: none; } div.WordSection1 { page: WordSection1; } Hi Paul: This correspondence causes me to recall that in the early 1970s, when I was arranging to have several of Zuse’s and Schreyer’s papers translated into English, for inclusion in my book “The Origins of Digital Computers” (Springer Verlag, 1973), I was very intrigued by Zuse’s “Mechanical Switching Element”, as portrayed in Figure 2 of his 1962 paper “Entwicklungslinien einer Rechengeräte-Entwicklung von der Mechanik zur Elektronic” (“The Outline of a Computer Development from Mechanics to Electronics”). So, I constructed a model Mechanical Switching Element out of little glued-together sheets of clear perspex (the largest of which were about 3.3cm x 1.3cm x 0.1cm), plus a 0.6cm-long floating metal rod (part of a gramophone needle). This model closely matched the scale of the diagram Zuse had provided in his paper – I didn’t and don’t know the dimensions of his actual switching elements. Despite my limited mechanical skills, the model switching element worked very well, and being transparent its operation was easily demonstrated. I used to keep it in my shirt pocket and show it off whenever the opportunity presented itself. Unfortunately, I lost the little model many years ago. Each time I look at Figure 2 I regret this loss! 😊 Cheers Brian From: Members <members-bounces@lists.sigcis.org> on behalf of "Ceruzzi, Paul via Members" <members@lists.sigcis.org> Reply to: Paul Ceruzzi <CeruzziP@si.edu> Date: Saturday, 8 July 2023 at 17:44 To: Evan Koblentz <evank@njit.edu>, Jesper Juul <j@jesperjuul.net> Cc: "members@lists.sigcis.org" <members@lists.sigcis.org> Subject: Re: [SIGCIS-Members] Zuse / binary Fascinating discussion. Zuse told me that he was taught binary arithmetic in grade school, but he only learned of Leibniz's essay on binary (ca. 1680) after Zuse began work on computers. Babbage was an admirer of Leibniz's work but did not consider binary for his engines. The Z1, which had a binary calculating unit, did not work well, and therefore Zuse adopted electromagnetic relays (a technology not available to Babbage) for his later machines, which did work. Attempts to reconstruct the Z1 for the Deutsches Technikmuseum using late 20th-Century machine tools also failed -- please correct me if I am mistaken. But note that Zuse built a successful mecahnical binary memory unit for the Z4, which not only worked well but which was in steady service at the ETH in Switzerland for years. The joke was that the clicking of the Z4 relays was the loudest noise in Zurich on any given evening. The Z4 is now at the Deutsches Museum in Munich. Paul Ceruzzi From: Members <members-bounces@lists.sigcis.org> on behalf of Jesper Juul via Members <members@lists.sigcis.org> Sent: Saturday, July 8, 2023 8:05 AM To: Evan Koblentz <evank@njit.edu> Cc: members@lists.sigcis.org <members@lists.sigcis.org> Subject: Re: [SIGCIS-Members] Zuse / binary External Email - Exercise Caution In Raúl Rojas' paper on the Z1/Z3(1), he writes that "instead of using gears (as Babbage had done in the previous century), Zuse implemented logical and arithmetical operations using sliding metallic rods. The rods could move in only one of two directions (forward or backward) and therefore were appropriate for a binary machine." The Z1 is 1936-38. This doesn't quite explain if rods or binary arithmetic came first, but there is a footnote to Zuse's book "Der Computer mein Lebenswerk". As a side note, I can recommend seeing the Z1 in the Technical Museum in Berlin if you are near. Jesper Juul 1) https://ed-thelen.org/comp-hist/Zuse_Z1_and_Z3.pdf On Fri, 7 Jul 2023 at 18:34, Evan Koblentz via Members <members@lists.sigcis.org> wrote: What are some good articles addressing why Zuse, Aiken, Stibitz, etc. decided to use binary (or not)? -- Evan Koblentz New Jersey Institute of Technology - Senior Writer, Office of Communications and Marketing - Adjunct Instructor, Ying Wu College of Computing - Faculty/Staff Advisor, NJIT Lego Club evank@njit.edu (973) 596-3065 https://web.njit.edu/~evank _______________________________________________ This email is relayed from members at sigcis.org, the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/ and you can change your subscription options at http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org
participants (9)
-
Brian E Carpenter -
Brian Randell -
Ceruzzi, Paul -
Evan Koblentz -
herbert.bruderer＠bluewin.ch -
Jesper Juul -
Johannah Rodgers -
Mark Priestley -
Pierre Mounier-Kuhn