<div dir="ltr"><div>Hi Paul,</div><div><br></div><div>In addition to the excellent links others have provided, I would also recommend the following two:</div><div><br></div><div>1. Alan Kay's "<a href="https://youtu.be/p2LZLYcu_JY?t=4031">Doing with Images Makes Symbols</a>" talk (the link is at a timestamp in the talk that addresses what you are thinking about, but the whole thing is worth watching)</div><div>2. Andrea diSessa's book "<a href="https://mitpress.mit.edu/books/changing-minds">Changing Minds: Computers, Learning, and Literacy</a>"</div><div><br></div><div>Though not directly related, I'll also recommend Walter Ong's "<a href="https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/164515.Orality_and_Literacy">Orality and Literacy: the Technologizing of the Word</a>". While this doesn't deal with computing directly, it *does* grapple with the earlier and perhaps more general idea of a medium enabling new kinds of thought that would have been previously "unthinkable" (or at the very least extremely difficult) without it. In this case the medium/technology is reading and writing. But, as perhaps Papert, Kay, and diSessa might have argued, this same principle could extend into computing, particularly when it comes to internalizing difficult concepts we associate with math.<br></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Thu, Oct 8, 2020 at 3:51 PM Bo An <<a href="mailto:bo.an@yale.edu">bo.an@yale.edu</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr">Hi Paul,<div><br></div><div>I second Morgan Ames's book and articles. For pre-GUI, here are some historical and cultural studies about figures like Andrey Ershov (second literacy) and Seymour Papert (LOGO) that might be helpful: </div><div><br></div><div><div style="line-height:1.35;margin-left:2em">
<div>Afinogenov, Gregory. “Andrei Ershov and the Soviet Information Age.” <i>Kritika: Explorations in Russian and Eurasian History</i> 14 (June 1, 2013): 561–84. <a href="https://doi.org/10.1353/kri.2013.0046" target="_blank">https://doi.org/10.1353/kri.2013.0046</a>.</div><div><br></div><div>Agalianos, Angelos S. “A Cultural Studies Analysis of Logo in Education.,” 1997. <a href="http://discovery.ucl.ac.uk/10018887/7/Agalianos%2C%20Angelos%20S.pdf" target="_blank">http://discovery.ucl.ac.uk/10018887/7/Agalianos%2C%20Angelos%20S.pdf</a>.</div><div><div style="line-height:1.35;margin-left:2em"><div><div style="line-height:1.35;margin-left:2em"><div><div style="line-height:1.35;margin-left:2em">
<span title="url_ver=Z39.88-2004&ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Fzotero.org%3A2&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Adissertation&rft.title=A%20cultural%20studies%20analysis%20of%20logo%20in%20education.&rft.aufirst=Angelos%20S&rft.aulast=Agalianos&rft.au=Angelos%20S%20Agalianos&rft.date=1997&rft.language=English"></span>
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<span title="url_ver=Z39.88-2004&ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Fzotero.org%3A2&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Adissertation&rft.title=A%20cultural%20studies%20analysis%20of%20logo%20in%20education.&rft.aufirst=Angelos%20S&rft.aulast=Agalianos&rft.au=Angelos%20S%20Agalianos&rft.date=1997&rft.language=English"></span>
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<span title="url_ver=Z39.88-2004&ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Fzotero.org%3A2&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=article&rft.atitle=A%20CULTURAL%20STUDIES%20ANALYSIS%20OF%20LOGO%20IN%20EDUCATION&rft.aufirst=Angelos%20S&rft.aulast=Agalianos&rft.au=Angelos%20S%20Agalianos&rft.pages=375&rft.language=en"></span>
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<span title="url_ver=Z39.88-2004&ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Fzotero.org%3A2&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=article&rft.atitle=A%20CULTURAL%20STUDIES%20ANALYSIS%20OF%20LOGO%20IN%20EDUCATION&rft.aufirst=Angelos%20S&rft.aulast=Agalianos&rft.au=Angelos%20S%20Agalianos&rft.pages=375&rft.language=en"></span>
<div>Lachney, Michael, and Ellen K. Foster. “Historicizing Making and Doing: Seymour Papert, Sherry Turkle, and Epistemological Foundations of the Maker Movement.” <i>History and Technology</i> 36, no. 1 (January 2, 2020): 54–82. <a href="https://doi.org/10.1080/07341512.2020.1759302" target="_blank">https://doi.org/10.1080/07341512.2020.1759302</a>.<br></div><div><br></div>
<span title="url_ver=Z39.88-2004&ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Fzotero.org%3A2&rft_id=info%3Adoi%2F10.1080%2F07341512.2020.1759302&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=article&rft.atitle=Historicizing%20making%20and%20doing%3A%20Seymour%20Papert%2C%20Sherry%20Turkle%2C%20and%20epistemological%20foundations%20of%20the%20maker%20movement&rft.jtitle=History%20and%20Technology&rft.volume=36&rft.issue=1&rft.aufirst=Michael&rft.aulast=Lachney&rft.au=Michael%20Lachney&rft.au=Ellen%20K.%20Foster&rft.date=2020-01-02&rft.pages=54-82&rft.spage=54&rft.epage=82&rft.issn=0734-1512"></span>
<div>Margarita Boenig-Liptsin. “Making Citizens of the Information Age: A Comparative Study of the First Computer Literacy Programs for Children in the United States, France, and the Soviet Union, 1970-1990.” Accessed August 14, 2020. <a href="https://dash.harvard.edu/bitstream/handle/1/23845438/BOENIG-LIPTSIN-DISSERTATION-2015.pdf?sequence=8" target="_blank">https://dash.harvard.edu/bitstream/handle/1/23845438/BOENIG-LIPTSIN-DISSERTATION-2015.pdf?sequence=8</a>.</div><div><br></div>
<span title="url_ver=Z39.88-2004&ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Fzotero.org%3A2&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Adissertation&rft.title=Making%20Citizens%20of%20the%20Information%20Age%3A%20A%20Comparative%20Study%20of%20the%20First%20Computer%20Literacy%20Programs%20for%20Children%20in%20the%20United%20States%2C%20France%2C%20and%20the%20Soviet%20Union%2C%201970-1990&rft.au=undefined"></span>
<div>Tatarchenko, Ksenia. “Thinking AlgorithmicallyFrom Cold War Computer Science to the Socialist Information Culture.” <i>Historical Studies in the Natural Sciences</i> 49, no. 2 (April 1, 2019): 194–225. <a href="https://doi.org/10.1525/hsns.2019.49.2.194" target="_blank">https://doi.org/10.1525/hsns.2019.49.2.194</a>.</div>
<span title="url_ver=Z39.88-2004&ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Fzotero.org%3A2&rft_id=info%3Adoi%2F10.1525%2Fhsns.2019.49.2.194&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=article&rft.atitle=Thinking%20AlgorithmicallyFrom%20Cold%20War%20Computer%20Science%20to%20the%20Socialist%20Information%20Culture&rft.jtitle=Historical%20Studies%20in%20the%20Natural%20Sciences&rft.stitle=Historical%20Studies%20in%20the%20Natural%20Sciences&rft.volume=49&rft.issue=2&rft.aufirst=Ksenia&rft.aulast=Tatarchenko&rft.au=Ksenia%20Tatarchenko&rft.date=2019-04-01&rft.pages=194-225&rft.spage=194&rft.epage=225&rft.issn=1939-1811&rft.language=en"></span>
</div></div><div><br clear="all"><div><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr">Best,<div>Bo An</div></div></div></div><br></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Thu, Oct 8, 2020 at 9:08 PM Fred Turner <<a href="mailto:fturner@stanford.edu" target="_blank">fturner@stanford.edu</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>
Hi Paul,
<div><br>
</div>
<div>One starting place might be Morgan Ames’ book The Charisma Machine: The Life, Death, and Legacy of One Laptop Per Child. Lots in there about how folks learn to compute post-GUIs.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Best,</div>
<div>Fred Turner<br>
<div><br>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>On Oct 8, 2020, at 11:56 AM, Paul Fishwick <<a href="mailto:metaphorz@gmail.com" target="_blank">metaphorz@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div>
<br>
<div>
<div style="font-family:Helvetica;font-size:18px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none">
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:11pt">There is a topic that has interested me, but I have been unable to make much headway in<u></u><u></u></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:11pt">past years since I am not sure where to look.<u></u><u></u></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:11pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:11pt">Consider that Kathy, an 8<sup>th</sup><span> </span>grade student, knows more about how to use a computer than<u></u><u></u></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:11pt">her parents, who may know more than her grandparents. When learning to use digital<u></u><u></u></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:11pt">technology artifacts such as “menu”, education is imparted on Kathy. She learns something<u></u><u></u></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:11pt">about tree structures, and possibly finite state machines (FSMs). This is done invisibly because<u></u><u></u></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:11pt">she did not have to learn discrete mathematics and automata theory to use the computer.<u></u><u></u></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:11pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:11pt">One hypothesis that all technology is this way. We use technology and technology<u></u><u></u></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:11pt">uses us (by invisibly transferring new mental models). The introduction of<u></u><u></u></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:11pt">the mechanical clock changed how we conceptualize time. Fast forwarding to digital<span> </span><u></u><u></u></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:11pt">technology, Kathy must have conceptualized trees and FSMs as mental models even<u></u><u></u></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:11pt">though this theory was not made explicit.<u></u><u></u></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:11pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:11pt">My searches have taken me to psychology (where the dominant discourse is about<u></u><u></u></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:11pt">dysfunction where technology is concerned), history of technology as well as the history<u></u><u></u></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:11pt">of science. This relates to math and computer science education too—teaching FSMs to<u></u><u></u></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:11pt">people through implicit means. Learning something without knowing that your learning<u></u><u></u></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:11pt">it.<u></u><u></u></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:11pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:11pt">If anyone on this list has a good place for me to dive, let me know.<span> </span><u></u><u></u></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:11pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:11pt">-paul<u></u><u></u></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:11pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></div>
<div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:10pt">Paul Fishwick, PhD<br>
Distinguished University Chair of Arts, Technology, and Emerging Communication<br>
Professor of Computer Science<br>
Director, Creative Automata Laboratory<br>
The University of Texas at Dallas<br>
Arts & Technology<br>
800 West Campbell Road, AT10<br>
Richardson, TX 75080-3021<br>
Home:<span> </span><a href="http://utdallas.edu/atec/fishwick" target="_blank">utdallas.edu/atec/fishwick</a><br>
Media:<span> </span><a href="http://medium.com/@metaphorz" target="_blank">medium.com/@metaphorz</a><br>
Modeling:<span> </span><a href="http://digest.sigsim.org/" target="_blank">digest.sigsim.org</a><br>
Twitter: @PaulFishwick</span><span><u></u><u></u></span></div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<span style="font-size:10pt">ONLINE: Webex,Collaborate, TEAMS, Zoom, Skype, Hangout</span><span><u></u><u></u></span></div>
</div>
<div style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<u></u> <u></u></div>
</div>
<span style="font-family:Helvetica;font-size:18px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;float:none;display:inline">_______________________________________________</span><br style="font-family:Helvetica;font-size:18px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none">
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This email is relayed from members at <a href="http://sigcis.org" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">sigcis.org</a>, the email discussion list of SHOT SIGCIS. Opinions expressed here are those of the member posting and are not reviewed, edited, or endorsed by SIGCIS. The list archives are at <a href="http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://lists.sigcis.org/pipermail/members-sigcis.org/</a> and you can change your subscription options at <a href="http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://lists.sigcis.org/listinfo.cgi/members-sigcis.org</a></blockquote></div><br clear="all"><br>-- <br><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div>Eric</div></div></div>